[FR] A Dead Bat in Bogota
#21
A friend of mine who I winged with read my field report and gave me the following advice. He's insanely good and felt it'd be proper to post it here:

Dope. Four big takeaways I see from this:
  1. You got meaningful experience pulling sets and leading: This is huge. Even if you didn’t fuck any of the girls, you still pulled. Should make it easier to bounce girls from a mall instadate to drinks at a nearby bar to your apartment, etc. It also exposed you to logistical difficulties you can face when you’re rolling solo but gaming sets. Usually in those situations, I’ll lean on the girl to try to get isolation so I’m not pulling extra people back to the house, “Tell your friends you like me,” “Tell your friends we’re gonna grab food,” “What’re you doing later? Can you ditch your friends?” Or the other option is to go with the group and hope there are somewhat workable logistics there. 


  2. You got meaningful experience with mixed sets: Most guys won’t open mixed sets. Most guys definitely won’t open mixed sets during night game when they’re out solo. That’s dope. Plus, you even got guys winging you. Textbook. You have a good social vibe by default, but working groups will help you get out of ‘hunter mode’ and more in ‘give value, have fun’ mode, which should improved your vibe overall. Plus, you’ll get to calibrate to a lot of different personality types more quickly working groups vs solo girls, which will improve your overall calibration much more quickly (and is super applicable to career success, where you have to get groups on your side to be anything more than a workhorse or a pawn). I’d continue to work nights at least once or twice a week just to round out your skillset.


  3. You learned to chill out a little: You know how you have the assumption that just being American in Colombia gives you a ton of value? If you can assume that same amount of value here in the States, girls will respond the same way. Ya, you’ll still have to be more gamey, especially at night, but one of your sticking points here for a while was trying to keep gaming when the girls already saw you as high value. Once you fully believe in your own value and fully internalize it and act out from that, girls will fall into that frame and eventually you’ll have to drop a lot of the high value stuff for a lot of sets.


  4. You (hopefully) learned not to game under the influence: Broooo lol. Your two big L’s in Colombia were both trying to game under the influence. It seems like an easy way out, but it’s such a disadvantage. Think about it: If you’re going out solo, you want to be the most sober dude in the room. Stuff can and does pop off. I’ve seen dudes get curb stomped, almost thrown off balconies, I’ve had good friend who got shot and killed over bar drama, I’ve watched really high value dudes totally throw their life away over coke. The stakes are real, man. What makes this even more risky is that game helps you shed your inhibitions and boosts your confidence. So do drugs and alcohol. If you put both of those together, it’s damn near impossible to calibrate and you will end up on the wrong end of things. Keep your eye on the prize. Get the reference of fucking girls when you’re stone cold sober and having girls fuck you when they’re also stone cold sober. I flat out won’t fuck a drunk girl–and I’m damn sure not gonna try to get them drunk on my dime (whole other can of worms that one can open up, especially if you’re not pro yet at holding frame and managing buyer’s remorse). Plus, that lifestyle just isn’t sustainable as you get older (one hangover and I’m off for days).


  5. Don’t judge a book by its cover: Good game is all fundamentally the same, but it has a million different presentations. With the Argentinian, you fucked yourself by looking at the surface level vs. paying attention to the subcommunications. This probably went way beyond just him being able to speak Spanish. Two ways I can tell tell a guy is most likely good with women is 1.) His voice and 2.) His eyes. I’ve met some very, very unassuming naturals, guys who, by looking at them (even in set), you would never suspect are total pimps. Really good game can be almost indistinguishable from regular convo unless you really know what to look for; it can even look pretty boring a lot of the time. Eventually this is something that you’ll be able to work to your advantage since you won’t be setting off as many of the socially-conditioned alarms in mixed sets vs. a 6’5 jacked dude or some Calvin Klein model-looking guy, especially once you get to a point where you can subcomm a lot of your value.


  6. Don’t make women your goal: Flags are for poles lol. But it goes beyond that–as soon as you make a woman the goal, you’re already gaming at a massive disadvantage. Your ego starts needing her to preserve or actualize an idealized image of yourself. You put too much pressure on yourself. You put too much pressure on the girl (she wants to aspire to you and see you as the prize). You fuck with your outcome independence. You artificially limit your abundance. The flags’ll come on their own and then eventually you’ll be like, fuck it, I can’t even remember anymore (Roosh never got to the that point, since his game was trash and he never internalized abundance and constantly saw himself as ‘ sneaking in and getting away with the sex’–take inspiration where you can, he had a lot of good ideas and was a talented writer, but he should be a bit of a cautionary tale for anyone getting in the game. Plus, you’re not the underdog. You’re not tricking these girls. You should be working to embody being a high value man.). Same principle goes for “types” of girls (think the ethnic dudes who pedestalize white girls and then bitch about how they can never fuck them), girls of a certain hotness rating (i.e., the guys who can fuck any girl beside their “perfect ten” or can’t approach legit hotties), girls of a certain “virtue” (the dudes who Madonna-Whore it up and then never get the “good” girl since he never games her proper or thinks she doesn’t want sex or ends up with an undercover slut who never shares her secrets since she can tell he’s judgmental), or doing certain numbers (like how I could never pull 3 new girls in a week when it was a goal for me vs. when I stopped caring about it). None of these things can be your goal. Just making them a goal will sabotage things for you. It sounds cheesy, but you gotta make yourself your goal and focus on your actions (fully within your control) instead of the outcomes (not fully within your control) and to base your self-worth on that. Better goals would be things like: Have as much fun as possible. Open any girls I like. Open difficult sets. Stay in set until someone tells me to fuck off. Try to pull girls out the venue. See how far I can lead girls on the street. Always escalate. Focus on maintaining my own state and staying upbeat even when girls flake. Etc., etc. Your results will be way, way better focusing on those things instead of looking at the girl as the prize. Just food for thought.

But overall, tons of value here. Take the time to milk it for all it’s worth and really internalize those references.
The man who thinks he can and the man who thinks he can't are both right.” - Confucius

“Flirting is not just something you say or do. It is something you embody.“ - Todd V

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#22
If it makes you feel better I see autistics north Americans and from other anglosaxon countries daygaming with no Spanish almost daily in Medellin (santafe and tesoro mall).

Overheard a few convo and they go exactly as you described - girls get impatient and throw a few no entiendo nada- so you are not alone
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#23
OP, just curious if you tried OG at all?
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#24
(02-24-2021, 04:21 AM)churros Wrote: Going to need to hear that lifetime lay count, OP.

Answer the question OP. Nobody can advise you until youi're honest about your situation.
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#25
(02-24-2021, 04:56 PM)churros Wrote:
(02-24-2021, 04:21 AM)churros Wrote: Going to need to hear that lifetime lay count, OP.

Answer the question OP. Nobody can advise you until youi're honest about your situation.

In life? 8 in total. 4 before I discovered game, 4 after
The man who thinks he can and the man who thinks he can't are both right.” - Confucius

“Flirting is not just something you say or do. It is something you embody.“ - Todd V

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#26
If you think that guys extremely long feedback is good advice you didn't learn you lesson here. The key is to not overthink things. That's the reason you failed in the first place. Aside from having Spanish just showing up and being normal will do the trick. The more you overthink things to more you will give off the exact opposite of the vibe colombian girls are attracted to.
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#27
(02-24-2021, 04:59 PM)Shimmy Wrote: If you think that guys extremely long feedback is good advice you didn't learn you lesson here. The key is to not overthink things.  That's the reason you failed in the first place. Aside from having Spanish just showing up and being normal will do the trick. The more you overthink things to more you will give off the exact opposite of the vibe colombian girls are attracted to.

It's moreso encouragement.

His advice was pointing out the massive pros I learned from gaming in Colombia and how I can apply said experience in the States and next time I go abroad.
The man who thinks he can and the man who thinks he can't are both right.” - Confucius

“Flirting is not just something you say or do. It is something you embody.“ - Todd V

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#28
(02-24-2021, 04:59 PM)Hegemon1984 Wrote:
(02-24-2021, 04:56 PM)churros Wrote:
(02-24-2021, 04:21 AM)churros Wrote: Going to need to hear that lifetime lay count, OP.

Answer the question OP. Nobody can advise you until youi're honest about your situation.

In life? 8 in total. 4 before I discovered game, 4 after

So you've had 4 bangs from how many approaches in America? Are you in a walking city or strip-mall shit hole?
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#29
(02-24-2021, 05:19 PM)churros Wrote:
(02-24-2021, 04:59 PM)Hegemon1984 Wrote:
(02-24-2021, 04:56 PM)churros Wrote:
(02-24-2021, 04:21 AM)churros Wrote: Going to need to hear that lifetime lay count, OP.

Answer the question OP. Nobody can advise you until youi're honest about your situation.

In life? 8 in total. 4 before I discovered game, 4 after

So you've had 4 bangs from how many approaches in America? Are you in a walking city or strip-mall shit hole?

Oof, I couldn't count.

I'm in Milwaukee, but travel to Chicago once a week.

Anyway, I started November, 2019 - February, 2020 and had to stop due to the lockdown. During that time I had three bangs. I restarted again June, 2020 with so far only one bang. However, my game is far more calculatable - as in, I can point out where I am in the set, what to do next, etc.

At this moment, I'm good at hooking, getting a solid phone number, etc. However, my primary objective is same-day-lays. So I generally take my targets to a Starbucks or something low investment. After that, I try to pull them home - it doesn't work out at the moment since I'm terrible at comfort, but getting better.

I'm getting a mixed response. Some people say I should just get a ton of phone numbers and plan dates out, while others encourage me to keep going for same day lays.
The man who thinks he can and the man who thinks he can't are both right.” - Confucius

“Flirting is not just something you say or do. It is something you embody.“ - Todd V

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#30
What age are you? Have you gotten honest and objective feedback about your visual appearance and general vibe from people that know you?
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#31
(02-24-2021, 05:35 PM)churros Wrote: What age are you? Have you gotten honest and objective feedback about your visual appearance and general vibe from people that know you?

28. And yes, Swoop the World is only one of many PUA sites/Discord channels/FB groups/private subreddits/etc I visit to get game knowledge. 

I'm a 7 looks-wise and naturally have a very fun vibe... if I'm not gaming.

When I game, I tend to get very strategic and technical.
The man who thinks he can and the man who thinks he can't are both right.” - Confucius

“Flirting is not just something you say or do. It is something you embody.“ - Todd V

Reply
#32
I notice your feedback is all online. Given your approach/lay ratio I suspect there may be something slightly off about your general presentation; something that would only be detectable in person.

You may want to work on your social skills in general outside of game, with other men, for example. That will help you become more natural because right now you're way too analytical.

I would advise against travelling for girls until you get this sorted. But by all means travel for adventure; that would have been more productive way to enjoy Colombia at this level.
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#33
High value "pickup" autist with a claimed 8 all time lays that now gives advice on how to bang Colombian women after not even getting even a kiss out of 76 approaches.... sounds about right.
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#34
(02-24-2021, 05:50 PM)churros Wrote: I notice your feedback is all online. Given your approach/lay ratio I suspect there may be something slightly off about your general presentation; something that would only be detectable in person.

You may want to work on your social skills in general outside of game, with other men, for example. That will help you become more natural because right now you're way too analytical.

I would advise against travelling for girls until you get this sorted. But by all means travel for adventure; that would have been more productive way to enjoy Colombia at this level.

My wing who posted the giant ass piece of advice on Bogota did note something in person.

He said I was easily overexcited and ungrounded many times.

My mind tends to wander alot, especially later on in the set if I feel like I'm getting bored talking to a girl. Same thing happens to people. At the moment, I feel like it'd be a better to focus on social skills instead of being extremely objective focused.

I need to learn how to have fun with everyone, not treat game like work.
The man who thinks he can and the man who thinks he can't are both right.” - Confucius

“Flirting is not just something you say or do. It is something you embody.“ - Todd V

Reply
#35
hey OP you missed a big piece of info about yourself - what do you look like and what race are you?
This is very important for us to give you a more appropiate feedback
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#36
(02-24-2021, 06:18 PM)wellrockthecity Wrote: hey OP you missed a big piece of info about yourself - what do you look like and what race are you?
This is very important for us to give you a more appropiate feedback

I believe I posted it above. I'm a 7 looks wise and I'm half-Filipino / half-White.

Interesting side note: Lots of Colombians thought I was Colombian, so they'd start speaking Spanish to me.
The man who thinks he can and the man who thinks he can't are both right.” - Confucius

“Flirting is not just something you say or do. It is something you embody.“ - Todd V

Reply
#37
(02-24-2021, 04:39 PM)nikks Wrote: OP, just curious if you tried OG at all?

Asking as my Spanish is probably like yours, but getting quite a few matches in Bogota and english speaking girls are not that rare
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#38
They spoke Spanish to you because you're in a Spanish speaking country. It doesn't matter what you look like. Especially since 95% of the country doesnt speak any English.
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#39
^ I could see how a half Flip half white passes for Colombian.

When I was in Mexico a few months ago, I passed for a brown Mexican, but my heritage is also SEA (and only SEA).

When I did that funny double date with RPB in CDMX with the two Colombianas, I asked my Colombiana if I looked Colombian, and she said yes.

To be fair though, I've never been to Colombia.

Separately, OP, it looks like you haven't met any other forum members.

None in Milwaukee, I understand, but Chicago as well?
If you haven't met anyone, I'll assume you're lying (h/t to Teedub from the old forum)
My response to the old "why you losers trash the West?"
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#40
(02-24-2021, 04:27 PM)Hegemon1984 Wrote: A friend of mine who I winged with read my field report and gave me the following advice. He's insanely good and felt it'd be proper to post it here:

Dope. Four big takeaways I see from this:
  1. You got meaningful experience pulling sets and leading: This is huge. Even if you didn’t fuck any of the girls, you still pulled. Should make it easier to bounce girls from a mall instadate to drinks at a nearby bar to your apartment, etc. It also exposed you to logistical difficulties you can face when you’re rolling solo but gaming sets. Usually in those situations, I’ll lean on the girl to try to get isolation so I’m not pulling extra people back to the house, “Tell your friends you like me,” “Tell your friends we’re gonna grab food,” “What’re you doing later? Can you ditch your friends?” Or the other option is to go with the group and hope there are somewhat workable logistics there. 


  2. You got meaningful experience with mixed sets: Most guys won’t open mixed sets. Most guys definitely won’t open mixed sets during night game when they’re out solo. That’s dope. Plus, you even got guys winging you. Textbook. You have a good social vibe by default, but working groups will help you get out of ‘hunter mode’ and more in ‘give value, have fun’ mode, which should improved your vibe overall. Plus, you’ll get to calibrate to a lot of different personality types more quickly working groups vs solo girls, which will improve your overall calibration much more quickly (and is super applicable to career success, where you have to get groups on your side to be anything more than a workhorse or a pawn). I’d continue to work nights at least once or twice a week just to round out your skillset.


  3. You learned to chill out a little: You know how you have the assumption that just being American in Colombia gives you a ton of value? If you can assume that same amount of value here in the States, girls will respond the same way. Ya, you’ll still have to be more gamey, especially at night, but one of your sticking points here for a while was trying to keep gaming when the girls already saw you as high value. Once you fully believe in your own value and fully internalize it and act out from that, girls will fall into that frame and eventually you’ll have to drop a lot of the high value stuff for a lot of sets.


  4. You (hopefully) learned not to game under the influence: Broooo lol. Your two big L’s in Colombia were both trying to game under the influence. It seems like an easy way out, but it’s such a disadvantage. Think about it: If you’re going out solo, you want to be the most sober dude in the room. Stuff can and does pop off. I’ve seen dudes get curb stomped, almost thrown off balconies, I’ve had good friend who got shot and killed over bar drama, I’ve watched really high value dudes totally throw their life away over coke. The stakes are real, man. What makes this even more risky is that game helps you shed your inhibitions and boosts your confidence. So do drugs and alcohol. If you put both of those together, it’s damn near impossible to calibrate and you will end up on the wrong end of things. Keep your eye on the prize. Get the reference of fucking girls when you’re stone cold sober and having girls fuck you when they’re also stone cold sober. I flat out won’t fuck a drunk girl–and I’m damn sure not gonna try to get them drunk on my dime (whole other can of worms that one can open up, especially if you’re not pro yet at holding frame and managing buyer’s remorse). Plus, that lifestyle just isn’t sustainable as you get older (one hangover and I’m off for days).


  5. Don’t judge a book by its cover: Good game is all fundamentally the same, but it has a million different presentations. With the Argentinian, you fucked yourself by looking at the surface level vs. paying attention to the subcommunications. This probably went way beyond just him being able to speak Spanish. Two ways I can tell tell a guy is most likely good with women is 1.) His voice and 2.) His eyes. I’ve met some very, very unassuming naturals, guys who, by looking at them (even in set), you would never suspect are total pimps. Really good game can be almost indistinguishable from regular convo unless you really know what to look for; it can even look pretty boring a lot of the time. Eventually this is something that you’ll be able to work to your advantage since you won’t be setting off as many of the socially-conditioned alarms in mixed sets vs. a 6’5 jacked dude or some Calvin Klein model-looking guy, especially once you get to a point where you can subcomm a lot of your value.


  6. Don’t make women your goal: Flags are for poles lol. But it goes beyond that–as soon as you make a woman the goal, you’re already gaming at a massive disadvantage. Your ego starts needing her to preserve or actualize an idealized image of yourself. You put too much pressure on yourself. You put too much pressure on the girl (she wants to aspire to you and see you as the prize). You fuck with your outcome independence. You artificially limit your abundance. The flags’ll come on their own and then eventually you’ll be like, fuck it, I can’t even remember anymore (Roosh never got to the that point, since his game was trash and he never internalized abundance and constantly saw himself as ‘ sneaking in and getting away with the sex’–take inspiration where you can, he had a lot of good ideas and was a talented writer, but he should be a bit of a cautionary tale for anyone getting in the game. Plus, you’re not the underdog. You’re not tricking these girls. You should be working to embody being a high value man.). Same principle goes for “types” of girls (think the ethnic dudes who pedestalize white girls and then bitch about how they can never fuck them), girls of a certain hotness rating (i.e., the guys who can fuck any girl beside their “perfect ten” or can’t approach legit hotties), girls of a certain “virtue” (the dudes who Madonna-Whore it up and then never get the “good” girl since he never games her proper or thinks she doesn’t want sex or ends up with an undercover slut who never shares her secrets since she can tell he’s judgmental), or doing certain numbers (like how I could never pull 3 new girls in a week when it was a goal for me vs. when I stopped caring about it). None of these things can be your goal. Just making them a goal will sabotage things for you. It sounds cheesy, but you gotta make yourself your goal and focus on your actions (fully within your control) instead of the outcomes (not fully within your control) and to base your self-worth on that. Better goals would be things like: Have as much fun as possible. Open any girls I like. Open difficult sets. Stay in set until someone tells me to fuck off. Try to pull girls out the venue. See how far I can lead girls on the street. Always escalate. Focus on maintaining my own state and staying upbeat even when girls flake. Etc., etc. Your results will be way, way better focusing on those things instead of looking at the girl as the prize. Just food for thought.

But overall, tons of value here. Take the time to milk it for all it’s worth and really internalize those references.

This is pretty good general life advice, I don't read much PUA stuff but most of this makes sense to me.



(02-24-2021, 05:39 PM)Hegemon1984 Wrote:
(02-24-2021, 05:35 PM)churros Wrote: What age are you? Have you gotten honest and objective feedback about your visual appearance and general vibe from people that know you?

28. And yes, Swoop the World is only one of many PUA sites/Discord channels/FB groups/private subreddits/etc I visit to get game knowledge. 

I'm a 7 looks-wise and naturally have a very fun vibe... if I'm not gaming.

When I game, I tend to get very strategic and technical.


I think this is your biggest problem, you're too into this stuff. I give you props for rolling solo, getting out there and talking to people in real life also for booking a ticket to a big crazy city like Bogota, especially during a pandemic, however, I don't think you realize how lucky you are with this chicas who drugged you, a lot of guys end up much worse, some die. Next time be more careful dude, going out alone in Colombia can be pretty sketchy, as you now know. I was your age when I first landed in Bogota over nine years ago, I didn't get laid for my first three weeks but was lucky to meet up with some bilingual local dudes to show me the ropes, I used to pay them to take me out drinking, partying and meeting chicas. Bogota is fucking tough city alone.

I think you should focus less on PUA and more on Spanish skills and saving money to come back down for a longer trip.
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